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adding extra injectors

 
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Tektrader69



Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 11:56 am    Post subject: adding extra injectors Reply with quote

Can someone please point me in the right direction for information about adding extra injectors rather than changing stock ones?

I have a Z32tt and want to add 2 720cc top feed injectors and leave the stock ones in place on the lower plenum.

Thanks in advance.

Graham
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SSS



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

this isn't a very good idea as it can lead to lean/rich conditions in the cylinders if the extra fuel is not distributed evenly.

The best solution is to add an extra injector per cylinder, at the start of each runner. I am doing this on a set of quad throttle bodies on my KA24E; using the stock 240cc injectors in their stock placement and a set of 460cc injectors in the runners just after the throttle plates.
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Lew_ecu



Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am working with someone to do just this. They have a remote mounted turbo (rear) and the plan is to inject an additional injector also in the rear. The long path to the intake should ensure proper mixing.

The injector will be PWM and controlled through a boost sensor that feeds a signal to vary the PWM in relation to the amount of boost.
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cb_drift



Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 472
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

how laggy is that design? i saw something like that on rides on discovery one time and thought it had to be a lag monster due to the intake pipe run and the distance from the engine the exhaust housing of the turbo was...
are they even worth the cost of the install for the lag/power increase?
yeah - i know its gotta be done there to pass the emissions laws n stuff tho - just curious if its as bad as i think it would be tho...
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Lew_ecu



Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He has a VG30e car with a T3 turbo and he says it hits pretty hard.

A major consideration is the diameters of both the exhaust pipe to the turbo and the return boost pipe also The exhaust pipe should not be greater in diameter than the turbo pipe of course.

Since his car has a 3.90 rear, it does have lag just due to that. But the actual cost, installation ease and time is very attractive. So are the other benefits like a cooler running turbo, long oil lines (like a built in oil cooler)

Edit: He sourced most parts online, second-hand, etc. his total costs were probably in the hundreds and not thousands. The actual STS turbo kits are expensive.

A major mistake would be putting too large a turbo on. Going conservative is always a good consideration. Putting this on a 4 cyl car might mean going to a very small turbo. But considering the hassle of turboing V6 and V8 cars, its an attractive alternative.
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tarmac-



Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 106
Location: New Zealand.

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

old post, yep.. but:

hows the oil return work? does it have some sort of pump to get it back to the engine?


i would have thought that as the exhaust gases cooled, they would become more dense so the lag shouldnt be to extreme?
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Lew_ecu



Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.club-s12.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=8278&st=120

Check his car out here.

Also, check out STS squires website. They sell a kit but anyone could do this with junkyard tech.
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dsagers



Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tarmac- wrote:
old post, yep.. but:

hows the oil return work? does it have some sort of pump to get it back to the engine?


i would have thought that as the exhaust gases cooled, they would become more dense so the lag shouldnt be to extreme?


tarmac, you correct. In choosing a rear mount turbo, drop down two sizes on the hot side, but keep the cold side the same size so your engine gets enough air.

As for the oil return, there are several methods, but you must suction the oil out of the turbo with a pump. STS uses an electric oil pump made for circulating hot differential fluid thru a cooler. Available from Summitracing.com

Some guys have successfully used a cheaper Shurflo pump that can handle oil, but they have to move the pump far enough from the turbos so the oil cools down some before reaching the pump. There are a couple more expensive elec pumps that are an even better choice than the first two mentioned above.

Finally, you can go the hardcore method. A dry sump oil system. Even if you do not want to convert your engine to a dry sump, you can still use a dry sump pump or some kind of belt driven oil pump, to pull the oil out of the turbos.

Dry sump pumps are also excellent for creating negative pressure in the crankcase when the boost kicks in and intake manifold vacuum is not available to suck the pressure out of the crankcase. One caution about using a dry sump pump for the crankcase. The pump rotors need some oil running thru them for lubrication, so figure out a way to plumb in a small oil feed line to the pump section used for the crankcase.

Now, figure out a way to feed fresh air to the compressor side of the turbos that will not ever allow rain or water to get into the turbo. A compressor blade spinning at 60K to 100K RPM will be sand blasted to destruction by water droplets. So, put the intake filter in your rear bumper, inside the spare tire well, etc... And use a special cover made to keep water out of air filters, also available from Summitracing.
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